Dilemma - advice needed

As a professional restorer myself, I can sympathize slightly with the restorer in question as it is easier than you might think to under estimate a job of that size, even armed with many years experience, even the best of us get caught out occasionally.

However, as many of you have said, he should have known that there are many things that could be hiding under the paint / underseal / years of patches and have at least warned you that it could get more expensive.

Whenever I do a quote I make sure that we have a good walk round the vehicle and discuss the many eventualities and try to give a best case / worst case scenario pricewise, and always make it clear that if other things turn up then it could be in the workshop longer than originally stated. If the customer is in a hurry for it then its usually best for both parties if we don't get the job to be honest.

Another way we try to avoid this problem is keeping the customer updated regulary, and encourage them to drop in whenever they can to see first hand what we are dealing with, that way if anything that wasn't in the quote turns up we can discuss the options there and then rather than just waiting till the end and risking either having to take a hit financially or telling the customer his bill has just gone up by 2 grand.....


So, now I have finished rambling.. :roll: , I have to ask,

Did he pre warn you of rising costs?

Did he keep you updated or did he just not mention it till you went to see why it wasn't finished? And out of interest, what exactly did cause the extra work?

Another thing that strikes me as odd is why isn't he finishing it? The amount of work remaining is fairly minor in the grand scheme of things..Surely it would be in his best interests to finish it, take it on the chin financially and get your bus out of his workshop so he can get the next job in?

crede999 said:

why not compriomise and offer to help out no offence intended but you could do the crap jobs make the brews rubbing down dcleaning etc etc anything to speed up the process , and you can keep an eye on whats happening to your bus (and him) :msn4: plus youll get time to bond with your bus and learn some new skills and things along the way

*Engine bay painting and engine putting back in............................3 days max
*Pop needs a final coat of white paint and putting back on..............2/3 days
*Final layer lacquer needs applying...............................................2 days
.................................................................................................= 8 days max not couple of months


He say's that he has massively underestimated the job and it should have been 2k more than originally quoted. ............ hes the restorer he knows whats involved :roll:


if hes not up for that id move it ,family and booked holidays are more important

i feel for you dude ive been there a few times but its your bus and your hard earned money at the end of the day

hope you get sorted

chris

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I agree, i dont think theres a lot of work to finish it, i think he might be hoping you offer more money to finish it by saying it will take another couple of months, i have a building company, we do jobs from £100 to £500k so i know this dilemma very well, and we have underestimated jobs but the quicker we get them done we can move on, weve taken worst hits then this but most we get right and better sometimes as im sure he does, we have never been offered more money and always aspected to finish as quickly as poss ,and on the other side we use sub contractors and once youve payed them it is hard to get them back to finish bits, they could be on another job earning more money as they have had the your money already,
The main problem is youve payed him, im not sure how you go about it but i think no more money and finished by the end of the month is fair, maybe say youve had advice from this forum from many vw owners poss customers ?
Would love to know how you get on,Thanks Dean

dubs and classics said:

However, as many of you have said, he should have known that there are many things that could be hiding under the paint / underseal / years of patches and have at least warned you that it could get more expensive.

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When we first made contact with the garage he gave us a quote of £5500 and when he started stripping the paint back he did encounter a few problem and we agreed to the extra funding when he walked around us around the camper.

dubs and classics said:

Another way we try to avoid this problem is keeping the customer updated regulary, and encourage them to drop in whenever they can to see first hand what we are dealing with, that way if anything that wasn't in the quote turns up we can discuss the options there and then rather than just waiting till the end and risking either having to take a hit financially or telling the customer his bill has just gone up by 2 grand.....

Click to expand...

We live in Germany and rarely get over to the UK however when we do we pop in and check on the work he's been doing, which we have been very happy with, apart from the time issues.

dubs and classics said:

Did he pre warn you of rising costs?

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Yes, When we made initial contact he warned that the original quote of £5500, could (and did) go up depending on what he found.

dubs and classics said:

Did he keep you updated or did he just not mention it till you went to see why it wasn't finished? And out of interest, what exactly did cause the extra work?

Click to expand...

Yes, we ring him every Monday morning and he tells exactly what he's found/done and the estimated time of completion which has been constantly slipping to the right. There hasn't been that much extra work from when we agreed the extra 2k, he tells us that he's had to spend a lot more time than originally planned on the camper and due to the extra time has eaten the money up a lot quicker than he thought he would. So i think that the extra work has been caused because he might have taken extra jobs of and bitten of more than he can chew.

dubs and classics said:

Another thing that strikes me as odd is why isn't he finishing it? The amount of work remaining is fairly minor in the grand scheme of things..Surely it would be in his best interests to finish it, take it on the chin financially and get your bus out of his workshop so he can get the next job in?

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this is the part that i can't understand, his workshop is jam packed and surely the extra space would mean that everything will speed up with the extra space.

Dean70bay said:

I agree, i dont think theres a lot of work to finish it, i think he might be hoping you offer more money to finish it by saying it will take another couple of months,

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I have offered him more money to get the camper back, but he has turned it down and says he will not take anymore money off us as it his fault not ours. So he's not trying to rob us off more money.

Cod_Almighty said:

dubs and classics said:

However, as many of you have said, he should have known that there are many things that could be hiding under the paint / underseal / years of patches and have at least warned you that it could get more expensive.

Click to expand...

When we first made contact with the garage he gave us a quote of £5500 and when he started stripping the paint back he did encounter a few problem and we agreed to the extra funding when he walked around us around the camper.

dubs and classics said:

Another way we try to avoid this problem is keeping the customer updated regulary, and encourage them to drop in whenever they can to see first hand what we are dealing with, that way if anything that wasn't in the quote turns up we can discuss the options there and then rather than just waiting till the end and risking either having to take a hit financially or telling the customer his bill has just gone up by 2 grand.....

Click to expand...

We live in Germany and rarely get over to the UK however when we do we pop in and check on the work he's been doing, which we have been very happy with, apart from the time issues.

dubs and classics said:

Did he pre warn you of rising costs?

Click to expand...

Yes, When we made initial contact he warned that the original quote of £5500, could (and did) go up depending on what he found.

dubs and classics said:

Did he keep you updated or did he just not mention it till you went to see why it wasn't finished? And out of interest, what exactly did cause the extra work?

Click to expand...

Yes, we ring him every Monday morning and he tells exactly what he's found/done and the estimated time of completion which has been constantly slipping to the right. There hasn't been that much extra work from when we agreed the extra 2k, he tells us that he's had to spend a lot more time than originally planned on the camper and due to the extra time has eaten the money up a lot quicker than he thought he would. So i think that the extra work has been caused because he might have taken extra jobs of and bitten of more than he can chew.

dubs and classics said:

Another thing that strikes me as odd is why isn't he finishing it? The amount of work remaining is fairly minor in the grand scheme of things..Surely it would be in his best interests to finish it, take it on the chin financially and get your bus out of his workshop so he can get the next job in?

Click to expand...

this is the part that i can't understand, his workshop is jam packed and surely the extra space would mean that everything will speed up with the extra space.

Dean70bay said:

I agree, i dont think theres a lot of work to finish it, i think he might be hoping you offer more money to finish it by saying it will take another couple of months,

Click to expand...

I have offered him more money to get the camper back, but he has turned it down and says he will not take anymore money off us as it his fault not ours. So he's not trying to rob us off more money.

Click to expand...

Ok i just dont understand why it cant be finished within max 2 weeks as it is 7 months over the finish date

Well it seems for the most part, apart from the timing, he has done a sterling job then, maybe he is just trying to get a couple of other jobs done to get his finances back on track?

Personally I would have thought it would be better to get yours finished and move on, another happy customer and all that.

Whatever the reason, I hope you get it sorted soon.

Well i've finally got the bugger back, here's a quick photo, i'll post more once i get back from my hols in France in a weeks time.

So bloody happy.

Looks pretty good

Ozziedog,,,,,,,,,,, :mrgreen:

A happy ending. That was a snip at £7500. Your restorer, if he was honest, probably underestimated by 50%, but few would pay that price.
This happens to me every time, and like your restorer, being honerable I take it on the chin. So much so that I'm not doing any more complete resto's. Ever. By which I mean buses that need work at every level - undercarriage, engine bay, panels, cargo floors, pop-top roof etc. When it all needs welding up it turns into too bigger job. The trouble is, as anyone who's done it knows, to do a thorough job it goes on and on and on. bodywork that should take 6 weeks takes 12, scraping glue off doors and inside panels takes days and so on.

Reading this thread I was going to suggest you split the difference and offer him a £1k but you've got it now :lol:. He's still done himself big time IMHO. I'm glad you took the advice and stuck with him.

Also I have to say it's a breath of fresh air that this thread was answered in an understanding (of the restorer) way and wasn't jumped on by people saying you should send the boys round/sue his arse etc etc.

Nice forum.

That's georgeous. Well worth the time and money.

That is looking really nice, makes me excited to get mine done now

Glad you got it all sorted in the end even if it took a little longer than you hoped. I'm a bit disappointed I didn't get in to see the finished article, I'll have to try and catch up with you at some point.

Well after picking it up and packing it to the rafters with stuff we probably didn't need, we headed straight off on a 2000 mile return trip to a little village near Bergerac to meet up with some friends and their parents. They are currently renovating an old farmhouse and in exchange for beer and food we would help out with whatever we could.

Here are some pics...

Night time pics




One of the many castles on the drive there


Me driving


One of the weird and wonderful sights en route


Eldest Codling (Ollie)


Middlest Codling (Oscar)


Baby Codling (Henry)


The friend's parents Gloria and Ken


The friends Jenny and Mike


Me and t'other half


Me and Ollie in morning


Some pics of Bergerac or Burger rat as the youngest calls it








The dog, Ken




A bit of gurning


Chateau du Biron


A bit of tree cutting


The journey home

I think a tip is in order. Just for that memory. Cheers. Nice bus too.